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Audiosculpt for Catalina

@heyho666

Thanks, I think I will start new threads for supervp command line questions but,

I think that would be a good idea. Concerning the examples that Antonio mentioned.
Examples in the supervp documentation are not working commands. These are examples that show how the has to be used.

what is wrong with the command below?

But for starters here a few fundamentals:

In most cases you have one input sound and one output sound.

The input needs to be specified with a -S filename the output has to be the last parameter of the command line. You find the can description under “Input options” parameter -S. You see all input options by means of supervp -hi or in the html help.

For the output file please read supervp -ho the section or in the html help “Output options”-> ‘output filename’

Note that on the terminal you should avoid spaces in file names. The terminal parses arguments as space separated char sequences. If you need a space in a file you need to put ‘’ around the complete file. (This has nothing to do with supervp, it is a feature of every command line)

Further you have a few setups that work directly in the time domain. (Sample rate conversion, transposition by means of resampling, file format conversion) You can run these without any more parameters.

Note that the -age parameter is a meta parameter that is composing transposition and formant transformation to achieve the age effect in TRaX. It is not fully documented and mentioned in the doc only for completeness. It implies time stretching (see error mentions dilation) so it will not work without further parameters.

For all others you need a pair of -A (for analysis) -Z for resynthesis and in between the processing options you want to apply. Adding only -A and -Z you get the most basic phase vocoder you can imagine. Quality will be accordingly. Still the command will work.

So for many of the flags you need to run: supervp ‘your flag with option’ -S file -A -Z outfilename.
This should probably have been written in the beginning of the help.

If you want high quality you would need to refine the analysis flag (-A) to have proper formant analysis. See fft analysis in analysis parameters. All analysis are described in the section Analysis modules or on the command line with supervp -hA

Then you would need to modify window size (-M) and select a shape invariant version of the phase vocoder (-shape 1). You find these and all other options related to processing parameters under processing options (in the html doc) or as output of supervp -hp.

Best
Axel

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Super helpful explanation! Will play more with these and ask in a separate thread about my questions :ok_hand:

Hello,

I’m a new user of this kind of software. I begin with TS2 and I see on forum people missing Audiosculpt. What are the differences between them ? Is Audiosculpt more complete/powerful ? Concretely, what is possible to do with AU and not with TS2 ?

Thank you in advance with your answer, all the best

Lisa

Hello Lisa,

In the details there are many differences. In a rough summary AudioSculpt does sound analysis and sound transformation, TS2 only does sound transformation. Also TS2 does not contain the sinusoidal model.

Best
Axel

Dear Axel,

Just a few additions to you very exhaustive comments, very much appreciated. I did experience a different quality between supervp~ commands and the same in AS, in some extreme cases, and not very big, but perceptible. I thought it was due to the limitations of Max, but, if I come across it again, I will mention it in the Forum.
However, when doing very heavy filtering, the difference between real-time and non-real-time-and-normalized results is huge. Post-normalizing the signal takes longer, than processing it in AS (and, if the signal already is integer, results in a worse quality).
Finally, our students in Stuttgart (and several other users I know) never use more than 2 channels and do not need editing techniques, as the have sequencers that handle this kind of things much more efficiently and powerfully. So, having this available in TS2 would not be perceived as a substantial improvement (but I see that other users have other requirements). However, they regularly use the command line without problems and generate parameter files by hand and algorithmically. Loosing this control would be a great loss for many of them (me included…!).
Thank you again for this interesting exchange.
Marco

Dear Marco,

My point was that there is no real time engine. Default parameters in supervp~ may have been selected differently. Notably because for transposition with the default algorithm (time domain based transposition) you have computation time linearly increasing with the transposition factor.
This is irrelevant in AS but was sesn as a show stopper in Max.

Therefore we created a transposition mode that can use frequency domain transposition to achieve computational costs that are mostly independent of the transposition, the frequency domain transposition has lower quality though. If time varying computational costs are not a problem for you, you can switch this off in the supervp~ objects. There is unfortunately a compromise to make.

So, having this available in TS2 would not be perceived as a substantial improvement

Yes - I perfectly understand. This does not help everybody.

Best
Axel

Thank you, I understand now why people is missing Audiosculpt.
So please tell me if I’m wrong, are today the SuperVP tools in Max the best solution to complete TS2 with sound analysis ?

Best

Lisa

If you’re interested in sound analysis, OpenMusic might provide an easier way than the Max patches. Of course Max has MuBu, but OM has Pm2. The command line tools have everything and then some, but they are not user-friendly. It all depends on what you want to do with the analysis, what your usual workflow is, and what kind of interface (or lack thereof) you’re comfortable with

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I see. Typically, I would like to “play” with a sound transforming it in many ways. Then “watch inside” what happens, with a sound analysis, and finally extract informations, like harmonies, enveloppes etc. Spectral-like attitude in short.
Using TS2 to transform a sound then OM with Pm2 to analyze it and extract musical informations is a good approach ?
Best
Lisa

That’s way beyond my understanding as a mere developer, but it’s the right kind of question to ask here (maybe also try repeating that in the OpenMusic community). It sounds right to me, but I’m not sure whether you’d get what you want from OM alone, let alone how to do it. I don’t think you’re the only person thinking about that, so casting a wider net could help

Dear Lisa,

In addition to Fred’s carefully well recommendations, i can add this:
pm2 and supervp in OM are non-realtime, meaning you can not use it in a performance. However, you will have full control of these wonderful binaries with their respective full capacities. The display is not as in Audiosculpt unfortunately (no sonogram), so you should rely mostly on commandline tunings as it is the case in AS. However the result is displayed in OM (in sdif, sdifedit [optional] and sound display), you can also use OM’s audio functions to display and layout markers, and such. I invite you to have a look on OMSuperVP and OMPm2 OM’s libraries here:


OM is freely downloadable here:

and is available to mostly all platforms.

The tutorial patches of these libraries are available from OM’s help menu.

Please don’t hesitate to post questions if needed in our OpenMusic disscussion group concerning OM or these libraries.

Best
K

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Thank you Cornu and Haddad, I forward my next question to the OM forum then.

See you there,

Best

Lisa

Hi I am new here ,

I was told Audiosculpt could me with my workflow

I am on the last update of Mac OS Catalina my computer will not go to Big Sir

So there is their any news in sight of even a beta version ?

Please consider using TS2 instead.

All the best

Hi there Sir,
Unfortunately I cannot afford that at $249
So I guess I wait for the AutoScuplt to be made for 64-bit

Hi,

If you have a premium individual account, you get a 50% discount.
If you have a premium academic account, you get TS2 for free, and you give your students a 50% discount.

All the best

Hi there I have a question about A workflow when using this kind of programs where do I ask ?

Hi

You ask here on this discussion list by creating a new topic :slight_smile:

Best
K

1 Like